BW Vampires? heck maybe even undead!!!

[Drozdal]

Hey my friend asked me recently are they Vampires in BW, i responded no - go create them - and pointed him to this forum, so far he didin't showed up - so maybe we'll do some brainstorming on that matter, as we'll waiting for him? ;]
How they should been presenteed, should new character or race traits been developed, or should we just add new UBER lifepath Vampire wchich can be merged with any existent one (consider like all lifepaths have lead to Vampire or even treat all undeads this way - which means that anyone can become undead cerature). Any thoughts?

Drozdal

Ps. I'm waiting for a storm here :) (Most likely Firestorm)

[Digital Apex]

This is from another forum post but I thought it would be very appropriate to repost here .... :D

What about a "deathpath"? Where you burn a character as normal for a NPC but then you must choose how they die, hence what type of "undead" they return as and have paths that allow for custom stories to occur?

E.G. A scout dies in the desert, his corpse sits under the sand until a evil wizard ensnares his soul to do his bidding and creates a "sand wraith". Later while he is scouring the desert, serving his master on some task his master is slain by heros and he is freed. Hence you have a "Sand Wraith" with depth to his story.

Maybe even have expanded deathpaths to simulate how decay has affected their appearance or how they staved off the rotting?

E.G. A cooper dies on ship, conditions are right for him to return as a "zombie". He wanders the ocean floor (Becoming bloated and fish eaten). Walks ashore to terrorize a costal village gets set on fire by torch weilding villagers and is sent back out into the sea. Thus 2 paths taken = blackened and bloated zombie who is afraid of fire. Again more depth, specially if the zombie is making crude barrels with rotting animals in them.

I say if your going to make evil something else why not have an
intelligent kind of evil? Is it more scary to see a rotting corpse walking slowly and mindlessly towards you? Or to see a rotting corpse squatting on the peak of a rooftop leering hungrily at you and then see it back away, slowly into the shadows with a grotesque smile on its face?

Its up to you....

[eruditus]

I like both... intelligent undead and savage monsters

intelligent undead give you a bredth of play - manipulators and combatants not fettered by the concerns of death. The ability to explore concepts of alienation and the concerns of the mind and body not quite alive and not quite dead.

however, the unintelligence undead can be downright horrifying. When faced with hordes they cannot be parlied with and no amount of expertise can save you. Only luck and an attempt to desperately out manuever them. I made some hopping vampires that were so fast and unrelenting that the mere suggestion of their presence made my players skin crawl and the characters would soon be looking around for the fastest way out.

[Digital Apex]

The Deathpaths should allow for both types, you can be young and pretty intact or old and either 1) Very powerful at a high cost or 2) Almost mindless because you have decayed to far with no knowledge of how to preserve yourself.

Again some ideas

[Drozdal]

The Deathpaths should allow for both types, you can be young and pretty intact or old and either 1) Very powerful at a high cost or 2) Almost mindless because you have decayed to far with no knowledge of how to preserve yourself.


Agree with this completly. But we have to consider playability of mindless zombie :], of course we can consider possibility of returning to "real" life (or real death), so zombie-player will have some chance or goal in roleplaying stinking, rotting, nearly mindless undead.

Drozdal

[Yagathai]

*snip!*...so zombie-player will have some chance or goal in roleplaying stinking, rotting, nearly mindless undead.

Nah. Any good zombie already has a goal: Braaaaaiiiiiiins

[eruditus]

Yeah, unfortunatley the deathpath system (TM) :) is really only useful for intelligent undead... unless we come up with a zombie system for losing skills and alternate stats. This would allow you to go through the process knowing who an NPC was (definately not for PCs) and what his skill set might have been. Thus his zombie version would react accordingly, just with less finesse.

That could be neat. Although I plan on looking at this further I have to say I am far too busy on other BW stuff to do much more right now. I will have to return to it :)

[Digital Apex]

That could be neat. Although I plan on looking at this further I have to say I am far too busy on other BW stuff to do much more right now. I will have to return to it :)

Hey now, I was ALREADY working on the.... ::ahem:: Deathpath "project" :wink:

[NiallNai]

On the subject of vampires, a couple of things need to be considered. Is the Anne Rice and Vampire:TM going to influence the design and have vampires seeking redemption and trying to lead a good life by only feeding on the guilty. Or are they meant to be evil creatures that now see all others as a herd from which to feed.

[eruditus]

BAH!

I think that could be an individual concept, not a theme for mechanics!

besides, inho vampire: TM is dead and I pray it stays buried and allow the WW folk to move on and produce new and exciting stuff.

[NiallNai]

True enough...on the first, but it can still affect lifepaths. For example, you could have a lifepath or part of a lifepath(maybe under an Outcast lifepath) for the Redemptive Vampire. Or a lifepath for vampires that sink even further into darkness than your run of the mill bloodsucker. Just a thought.

As for White Wolf...I really wonder if their Time of Judgement is really going to bring an end to it all. They been working with the Storyteller System for so long, who knows if they'll be able to do anything else. Hell, Mark Rein-dot-Hagen left when he was trying to do that Exile sci-fi rpg all those many years ago (1996 I think).

But I hope that the Masquerade is over.

[nebulousmenace]

White Wolf HAS done other things. I had a long time Aberrant game going.

Adventure! is a great game. Seriously.

I think they're going to relaunch the "New, with 90% less Eighties feel" World of Darkness, but I have no actual info on that.

As for Burning Wheel: The Rolling, I'd personally rather not. Angsty cursed antiheros have been done to. . .uh. . .exhaustion. For dead NPC's, fine. Dead PC's, not so interesting.

[eruditus]

I have to disagree. I love angstiness as long as its not overdone. I find the idea of undead PC to be intriguing. What I really didn't like about vampires was the "I am dead and beautiful" perspective. I almost always played nosferatu in vamp :)

But alternate types of undead are interesting - is my spirit bound to a loved one and I must learn how to make the connection to the physical world (ala Ghost) to save them? Has someone bound my spirit to a body to carry out their own plans and how can I escape? maybe I am trying to escape my own past, attempting to redeem my former actions before jugdement is cast upon my soul.

And, of course, there is always the arduous path of the lich.

I am all for the idea that death is only the beginning for many character types :)

[NiallNai]

Well, a question for both the Werewolf and Undead topic AND about the intent of Monster Burner in general, are they supposed to be rules for creating alternate PCs or rules for creating detailed NPCs.

Don't get me wrong, I love the Great Wolves especially and can easily see how one might fit into a group of adventurers, as well as, being it's own campaign with a pack of wolves. And I can see the potential of an "evil" campaign.

My intent for the werewolves was to make the classic werewolf, with a look at its folklore roots. Those were the ones that seemed to fit in best with a lifepath approach.

Sorry to repeat myself, but I'm not that message board savvy.

[Kublai]

I think the idea for the Monster Burner is to allow players to create a select few monsters as PCs, as well as detailed NPCs. Then there will be a host of templates from which you could theoretically play as a PC or NPC - there would be no lifepaths, however. I think it would be grand to develop LPs for all the included monsters... maybe one day.

[eruditus]

hmmmm... maybe a few monster based humanoid lifepaths WOULD be cool for the monster burner. Just a page or two of "you turned into this at age 18," etc. That would be pretty cool and certainly lead to some interesting campaign ideas.

Lifepaths:
bitten by a vampire
vampire blood doll
bitten by a werewolf
lyncanthropic legacy
cursed
back from the dead for vengence
summoned back from hell
deep one experiment

and leads so some great traits... thirst for blood, hunger for flesh, run on all fours, compulsive counting, can only hop...

*drool*