Wounds

[Lebo77]

Check my reading of the rules here:

If you have a two superficial wounds, you have to add two tothe DN on your dice, right? If however you recieve another superficial wound, then you no longer all two to your DN and insted subtract one die from all your tests.

Now under that assumption I can propose a situation where it is in your best intrest to stab yourself, in order to improve you ods of success on a test.

Assume (for ease of computation) that you have a skill of B6. If you are unwounded you roll 6 dice looking for 4,5 or 6. You expect you will get 3 suceses. Now if you have suffered a superficial wound, you will roll 6 dice looking for 6, expecting only a single success. However, if you stab yourself in the leg with your knife, doing 1 addaitional sup wound, you would instead be rolling 5 dice looking for 4,5,6 again. This has an expectation of 2.5 successes.

Unless I miss my mark, something is rotten in teh state of Denmark here...

[Drozdal]

Welcome Lebo77

Thing that you've just mentioned was a main issue with combat rules, not because it was broken, but it messed with target number on dice (which confused people most of people durning demo games). So there is another wounding mechanic avail it's a little bit more harsh but hey it's Burning Wheel after all :P

It works like this: When you get superficial wound your Ob goes up by 1 (instead of 1 now you need 2 sucesses), another superficial does nothing (in first version it raised your Ob further by another 1 so instead of 1 you needed 3 - but after playtesting this came up as to harsh), and after another superficial you lose a die - that's it!

Drozdal

Edit: Imessed up Ob's with DN's :P

[rafial]

Hello Lebo77 ... Just so you don't feel like you are taking crazy pills, some others of us are a little dubious about this statistical oddity. It's interesting to note that in both the rules as written, as well as the new varient being tested, having one superficial wound is worse for your chances of succeeding on future tasks than having -1D (which happens at Mid or Light, depending on which varient you are using).

The thing that got me thinking again lately was the notion that if you have a character w/3 superficial wounds, who gets attention for them, if the healer succeeds in treating at least one, but doesn't get them all, the character is now worse off then had they not sought treatment at all... yow!

The problem all boils down to the fact that is is hard to model a penalty smaller than -1D == 1/2 Ob without making the die rolling complicated.

[luke]

next time i see you all at cons i am going to biff each of you really hard off the head with a basketball and then challenge you to a fight before you can clear the cobwebs from your head. we'll see how you disregard supies after that!

lebo, check out the alternate wounding mechanics:
http://burningwheel.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=226

-abzu

[Drozdal]

next time i see you all at cons i am going to biff each of you really hard off the head with a basketball and then challenge you to a fight before you can clear the cobwebs from your head. we'll see how you disregard supies after that!


Try me!

Dro

[LordSmerf]

I was thinking about this very thing. I very much dislike that both the old and new damage systems have greater sustained penalties for superficial wounds. I do however take Luke's point that the strike of a superficial wound is stunning. Would it be workable to have superficial wounds give a +1 Ob penalty for the exchange they are dealt in and the exchange immediately following, or perhaps until an action is taken to "clear the cobwebs?"

Just a thought...

Thomas

[luke]

:twisted:
heh. you guys are too quick for me.
The problem with a wounding mechanic is that it relates directly to its recovery mechanic. One without the other is like a...um...leg without... um... ferget it.

have no fear! we've been playtesting new recovery mechanics at BWHQ. Soon to be posted.

just got to beat the shit out of my players a few more times...

- :roll:

[wattj]

next time i see you all at cons i am going to biff each of you really hard off the head with a basketball and then challenge you to a fight before you can clear the cobwebs from your head. we'll see how you disregard supies after that!

lebo, check out the alternate wounding mechanics:
http://burningwheel.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=226

-abzu

Okay, but as soon as you biff someone with a basketball, I'll take a whack at your ear with a baseball bat. Then you can challenge whoever you biffed with the backetball. But if it's me, I'm keeping the baseball bat, too.

The point of the dispute is not that being hit in the head with a basketball isn't challenging. It's that it shouldn't be more challenging than, say, being hit in the head three (or two) times with a basketball, or being hit upside the head with a club.

[eruditus]

See my reply from the other wounding post...

Artha expenditures and incapacitation rules significantly alter the truth of this thread. Ob modifiers are much easier to get rid of at one Artha per Ob penalty. Also, a additional die loss removes another chance at open ending a roll.