magical item creation and distribution for GM's

[ronnieB]

the following scenario is based on a real..Ahm..Scenrio (no lemmings were harmed during the re-enactment)
GM: you finally break the last lock, it drops to the ground with a loud "clang"
Gamer A: great! Let’s open that chest already!
GM: the chest is laden with coins and there's an exquisite looking sword lying on top of the gold
Gamer A: I’m examining the sword
Gamer B: probably magical
Gamer C: zz zz zz zz
GM: the sword is engraved with strange runes and when you pick it up and try it, it feels lighter and more swift then a normal sword should be
Gamer A: yay! It is magical! Dibs on the sword!
Gamer B: what kind of runes?
Gamer C: zz zz zz zz
GM: what?
Gamer B: the runes, what can I make of them?
GM: ahm...<fumbles with his notes for a few seconds> ahm... <thinking>
Gamer B: well?
GM: ahm.. You can't make anything because...ahm the runes are ornamental, yes that's it- the runes are purely ornamental
Gamer A: so no one challenges my right for the sword? Going once...
Gamer B: <jaded> let me guess, just another +1 sword with no history you just pulled out of your a$$
Gamer A: going twice...
Gamer C: zz zz zz zz
.
.
.

One of the things I loathe most about D+D is the magical items- so many of them it doesn't feel like magic, it feels like some enterprising mage opened up a factory for the damn things
Unfortunately, this problem is not unique to D+D, it can happen in any roleplaying system
<hey, another wand of kalashnikov to my collection!>
Ways to curb the problem:
1. When creating an item for use in your campaign always make up some history and details, specifically: who was the creator, why was the item created and how long ago was the item created
<you see a beggar panhandling 'the one ring' rings at the corner>
2. Now try to think about how the item got where you want - was it stolen 300 years ago by a bandit who fell off a cliff with it or was it handed from father to son?
<now at Archio's, sword of limb chopping with every happy meal! Collect them all!>
3. Don’t make another "shield that provides somewhat better defense"! Item creation is hard and costly- every item should be unique and powerful
<a 'Slietly Rotten Turnip of God Slaying'? What will I do with that?>
4. Keep the items few and far between, remember that one vorpal sword is about the equivalent of an SMG loaded with armor piercing ammo- not something you want every henchmen having
<mmm cheesy poofs of everlasting crunch...>

This article needs more work, but I ran out of time- so post opinions and I’ll be back when I can

[Catalyst]

There are some resources that might be helpful out on Der Web with just about any "random" generation. I find lists of names and things like that to be very good memory-joggers. See here for an example I just Googled for magic items (put on sunglasses first) :

http://www.maranci.net/cparchmi.htm

Massage results to fit them into your game, and BAM!

If you have a laptop in use during play, bookmark some of these or save the pages (without awful colored backgrounds if you like) to your laptop and build a "RPG links" page referring to online content and content on your laptop to keep it organized.

Other issue to talk about: Don't be afraid to tell the players "Hey, I didn't think about that/don't have anything on that. What do you guys think would be appropriate?" Bring in their creativity also. Might start up some new plots and get them more involved. Of course, you as GM have to moderate such things to ensure that they'll work within your game world.

Also, while they might come up with some interesting ideas, you as the GM need to make it clear that you don't have to take them directly, their words are suggestions, not dictums. They might jog your creative juices into overdrive so you can manage the situation, too.

They back you into a corner on something you haven't detailed, turn it around in a friendly way. Share that creative burden, they're making the story, too :)

[ronnieB]

the real problum is the sheer amount of magical items- i'v yet to see the campign setting where there's less then 16 ton's of them ;)
i know, i know i'v been DMing too and i know how fun it is to constantly make new stuff for the PC's to use. but then you can end up suppling the villain with stuff to counter all those gizmos and before you know it you'v completey destroid the balance of power in the campaign

[Catalyst]

You could just remove the offending magical PC equipment. Better yet, cause the PCs to remove their equipment themselves...

Why does it suddenly start smelling horribly of fish around me whenever I wear my Armor of Mondokewlness? (wonderful for sociopolitical sessions, trying to sneak around undetected...)

I've been seeing lots of skulking/flying/slithering naughty-looking tough persons/creatures lately who've been watching me... What could they be after, maybe all my magical stuff or my suspiciously bulging pack?

But I don't want to give you my Sword of Total Awesomeness to get the cure to the disease that's rotting my <fill in body part(s)>...

Whaddaya mean I feel stupider/weaker? I just blasted a dozen orcs with this staff, that's not stupid... My mind/blood/ is being used to power the staff? Oh.

I have a cloak that protects me from fire, great! Why did I take triple damage from that cold attack? (countering disadvantage to an advantage given by a magic item)

And of course there's the "Previous Owner" schtick, like that Sauron guy with his Cracker Jack ring of power :D Keeps players on the run while they try to use things.

In short, you're always in control if you want to be. Balance is up to you to keep or toss out.

I do recommend rather than just taking things away from players, give them a situation where there's a choice, but be ready to inflict consequences if they decide to go that route.

[luke]

it's funny, i'm dealing with this a bit right now. Or have been since this summer.

I am working on the Enchanting rules for BW. I have the Enchanting wheel all set up (imagine the WoM but for making STUFF). And I think I have some fun mechanics. But I am terrified of releasing such a beast on unsuspecting players and gms everywhere.

The last thing this game needs is hoards of swords of death being tossed around. Since enchantments tend to be a bit longer lasting and more far reaching than spells, I am nervous about handing this really cool system over.

BTW, it's not quite done yet. We're still play testing.

Oh yeah, my players generally complain that I "screw" them and either ruin their magic items or just don't give enough. In fact, I've been called "the cheapest, most miserly GM evar!"

So any advice for an erstwhile game designer who WANTS to put the power in the players' hands, but also wants to do it right?

-L

[LordSmerf]

My solution would be prohibitively high TNs for making things permanent. Like 10+ for making a constantly burning torch.

Then allow all sorts of "Flaws" in the design (intentional or otherwise) to lower the TN. Oh yeah, the torch only works from midnight to noon. Oh, did i mention that using that sword against white oak causes it to shatter?

That would go a long way in my opinion. Another option is to make enchanting require some prohibitively expensive materials. Like Enchantments can only be focused on perfect gems of 1 karat or more type of thing. Or require some special metal or alloy that is difficult to refine.

Alternatively, just release it as something that's incredibly powerful with some notes that it is incredibly powerful. Something like The Riddle of Steel's magic system. It openly acknowledges that mundanes vs. magic users gets ugly fast...

Thomas

[Catalyst]

I'm with Lord Smerf on this one. It sounds like a good way to balance things out for gamesters and munchkins.

Another take on magic items might be to try to think of every magic item as a plot hook (or hooks) rather than just as a reward. It changes the near-arbitrary nature of getting magic items for players quite a bit and helps GMs to make 'em memorable.

[Kublai]

I can't recall a magic item that Abzu handed out that was never a plot hook. Of course, he also made them incredibly hard to figure out what they did or how to use them, so we missed an awful lot of plot hooks.

For instance, my mage has an amulet he took from another mage. He's studied it for over a year and has come up with zilch beyond "it's protective in nature." My big worry is that it's doing something that I don't know about and Abzu forgets because I can't remind him!

This approach has definite drawbacks, however. The mystery is sometimes too hard to figure out and the players lose interest in it. One player even tossed aside a seemingly immensely powerful weapon because he couldn't figure out anything about it. And yes, it was immensely powerful and our enemies do use it against us all the time. :cry:

[Kaare Berg]

just to butt my head in, I am one for creating items with history, and then adding powers to fit their history. Or going the other way, having a concept of what the item would do, how did it get there? Kinda like character burning.

would it be an idea to have some sort of system for resonating magic. Magic sword given as a gift, used in horrible war and imprinted with the stubborness of its wielder ect. (yeah, I know, you have read this before)

My point is, magic is mutable not science. How about a sort of lifepath system for magic items:

Given as a gift: X enchantment points (like traits)

Wielded in war: Y enchantment points

Lost to tradgedy : Z enchanment points, A cursed points

Not as a hard fast set of rules, but a tool for those of us who wear the GM mantle?

[Catalyst]

just to butt my head in, I am one for creating items with history, and then adding powers to fit their history. Or going the other way, having a concept of what the item would do, how did it get there? Kinda like character burning.

That sounds like useful fun. I might do that for some ruins I'm running some players through. The "lifepath" would include "born as" paths like "dropped from the sky", "mistake", "initially forged by <race X>"... But if it were up to me to put into an official BW supplement, I'd label it as optional and just list the idea. I'd tie it a bunch to the setting when I was doing it, which will vary a bunch for different BW GMs. I really like the idea, though. Bit of random fun on charts... Hee!

Abzu, just tell your players that there just ain't much magic stuff around. Maybe they should try to make some themselves so you can test out any catastrophic failure rules you have? :twisted:

[Malcoros]

I think that I know what you mean about magic items in general and especially weapons. In most campaigns those things are so common that PCs naturally start to treat their big badass rune swords as if they were all "Dirty Harry" with his pistol, and that is what magic basically becomes!
Ive solved this decently in the past by altering the technology available to players, setting my campaigns in a a period with much earlier earth equivalent of technology (about the early iron age.) Although the actual components of iron and steel weapons are more common than bronze, I restrict the technological knowhow of blacksmithing only certain areas, and PCs only start off with bronze weapons and probably leather armor. Of course you have to make rules for bronze vs. steel and vice versa, but Ive found that this allows you to upgrade characters' kits and give them cool weapons and armor without having to say "longsword +1," and it can also be an interesting setting.

[Mulciber]

So, how's Enchanting coming, then (if I may ask)? I know your concentration in writing is on the Monster Burner, so I guess what I'm mostly asking is, is Enchanting something that's been shoved aside by the behemoth that is the Monster Burner?