two questions

[elgorade]

Perception:
It seems like the Perception stat will rise pretty fast,
at least for characters w/o observation training. If
there is anything sneaky going on they are likely to
be making an challenging test every session because
of their double obstacle penalty. Worse, it seems like
characters with Observation training lose out since
their obstacle is lower, their perception isn't likely to
advance as fast.
Am I missing something?

As a related question/comment, it does seem like
Perception is the stat most likely to go up in play.
Everyone can try perception tests (and will given half
a chance) and they seem pretty likely to come up.
I suppose the real "answer" to that is simply not roll
them as often, but take one overall perception test
for how on the ball the character is that day.


Natural Defenses:
Speed (or Power) is the defense against a charge.
Does that mean that the defender rolls the number of
dice equal to his speed for his defense, or that the
charger needs more than his speed sucesses? Of
course the question generalizes to other cases. Does
having to exceed the target's will with a spell mean
the targets will or the number of sucesses the target
gets when rolling his will dice?
I assume the target is the stat directly. That makes
the most sense for resisting spells. But it does seem
to make suceeding on a charge or a disarm or a
social skill pretty hard. So I want to confirm my reading.

Thanks

[Kane]

Well, I can answer the first one for you. Only successful Perception tests count towards advancement. (page 56)

[luke]

Elgorade,

You bring up a very good point regarding play in Burning Wheel. If a GM is constantly forcing his players to make tests, then his players are going to benefit from his cruelness and their characters' abilities will advance.

So the idea, behind the scenes, is to strike a balance and to have players rolling when it is significant to the story -- and when it is vital for them to advance.

As for your other question, Speed or Power Natural Defenses are rolled against the the charger's Power (+D). Highest successes wins the test, ties got to the defender.

Speed is allowed for characters who are nimble enough to get out of the way. Power is allowed for characters who are strong enough just to stiff-arm the attacker and shove them off.

hope that helps,
-Luke

[elgorade]

Thanks Kane. I had forgotten that point. And it is important else having a stealthy opponent or a few hidden objects could really change people's stats. Even one test a session raises things pretty fast if it is almost always a challenging test (because they don't have observation skill).

Would it be safe to extrapolate and say that for any open-ended test (designed open-ended, not as a result of spending artha) only a sucessful test counts for advancement. That would make sorcery and steel harder to advance, but again they are rolls that you are likely to get fairly often.


Thanks Luke. It seems I was wrong there as well. Not that I mind being wrong --- if I did I wouldn't have asked the question. :-)

Elgorade

[Kublai]

Would it be safe to extrapolate and say that for any open-ended test (designed open-ended, not as a result of spending artha) only a sucessful test counts for advancement. That would make sorcery and steel harder to advance, but again they are rolls that you are likely to get fairly often.

I don't think this is a good extrapolation at all. :(

As it stands already, Sorcery is the hardest skill to advance as it is. That's because you rarely roll Sorcery without adding in your Will, which pretty much ensures that every casting will be Routine. As for Steel, it's also very hard to raise as is, especially since most people are already set up to fail it (average Hesitation is 6, average Steel is 5). Since most Steel tests are going to be straight, this also means that getting anything other than a challenging test is hard!

As for open-ended rolls like Dwarf Crafts or Elf Songs, since they are skills, they work just like other skills in advancement, and therefore requiring only successful tests would be harsh.