Anyone Read French?

[luke]

http://tartofrez.canalblog.com/archives/2007/08/17/5920210.html

Apparently, it's an unfavorable review of Blossoms, but it's in French!

Can anyone translate?

-L

[robustyoungsoul]

You could try Google Translator, it can kind of help with the gist but it mangles it a bit (http://www.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Ftartofrez.canalblog.com%2 Farchives%2F2007%2F08%2F17%2F5920210.html&langpair=fr%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF8).

[luke]

I hate those translators.
I get the gist, yes, but the tone's off.

Also, he doesn't play Burning Wheel! Awesome!

Anyone?

[sanjwise]

Luke,

I briefly read it and its not all that bad. Its a little hard for me to follow what he's saying, but, in the first to paragraphs he says that he didn't find any huge historical inacuracies, even going so far as to say that you guys managed to synthesize the major conflicts of the epoque very well.

He says that you get the sense that you are immersed in a world that moves, 'bouge', and will soon undergo a great amount of change.

He appreciates the lifepaths, the various clan burners etc. and says that they all help to create very solid campaigns that fit neatly into the world.

I think his only gripe, one which he brings up in the second to last paragraph, is that by streamlining the conflicts into grand themes, through the various burners, he feels that in playing this game he would not get the full joy of exploring the setting more fully. He would have liked a more historical game.

His last paragraphe:

"A titre personnel, je cherche essentiel deux choses d'un jeu historique, une compilation afin d'avoir tout ce qui m'est nécessaire pour jouer, y compris et surtout au niveau des connaissances historiques, et une mise en perspective qui me fasse ressortir ce qu'il y a d'intéressant à jouer à l'époque et qui m'inspire. Pour moi, "blossoms are falling" est franchement mauvais sur le premier point et excellent sur le second."

Personally, when I want to play a historical game, I look for two things; one, an indepth compilation (of the setting) so that I have everything I need to immerse myself into the world, especially on a historical level, and two, a perspective that inspires and draws forth all that is interesting from the time period. For me, the Blossoms are Falling is poor on the first criteria and excellent on the second.

He also mentions several times that he doesn't know the Burning Wheel system and would probably get more out of the books if he did.

So there you go; not so bad. But like I said, I think a fracophone, will understand a lot more than I have so, I could be wrong in my interpretation.

later,
Sanj

[Yagathai]

Yeah, what Sanj said. He wants what amounts to a Forgotten Realms atlas or Rifts setting book, and you're giving him, well, Blossoms.

[luke]

Thanks, guys!

It's good to know that even when we do a setting-heavy book we still can't please the guys who want setting-heavy games!

-L

[Kudzu]

Thanks, guys!

It's good to know that even when we do a setting-heavy book we still can't please the guys who want setting-heavy games!


Luke, you say that almost like it's a bad thing. It ain't. :)

From the Babelfish translation (which is hilarious, based on what miniscule amount of actual French I remember from college), I get the impression that he doesn't get the big concepts of BW AT ALL and he does say up front that he's never read the BW rules. That last part boils down to something like "I wish he wouldn't tie all the cool setting stuff to these downer conflicts and struggles. I just want to cruise around, digging the setting, man." (<-- my translation in a world where French simulationist gamer dudes talk like stoned hippies)

He doesn't understand the first fundamental truth of BW: "Conflict fucking ROCKS."

Steven

[brand]

I don't know if I am a French simulationist gamer dude, but I would definitely like to sound like a stoned hippy ;)

While browsing on the Internet, I found a link to this thread. It looks like there is some confusion about my review of BaF, so I would be happy to make it clearer.

1) First of all, I do understand what conflicts and struggles are. As a matter of fact, I am a game designer myself and used to wrote articles about conflicts (a few other concepts) to introduce the concept to my french speaking readers (we don't have much conflicts oriented game mechanics in France). Furthermore, I do understand as well that BaF is not a game whose purpose is to give an indepth explanation of what Heian Era Japan was.

These things are perfectly clear to me, and, to be honest, are to most of the people who read the review.

2) I do not play BW as such. I never had. I would like to though.
I read many parts of Burning Empire without never reading it from beginning to end. I must admit it is a bit too rule-heavy for me and I always had something else to do, but I enjoyed many things I read from it. Most of it, really. I also have enjoyed several things I read from M. Crane on forums.

I am also fond of historical medieval japan RPG's. I am playing in this kind of game since the late 80's and have a collection of so focused games.

Thus, even though I knew I wouln't use most of the book (the rules), I was interested to read Baf :
- for the sake of making my collection one item bigger
- because I was very interested into Luke Crane's gaming perspective about this specific setting
- because a bunch of people knowing my inclination to indie games and medieval japanese games asked me my advice about the game.

3) So my review says more or less this :

- I can only speak about some part of the book, the part which is about japan or about "generic" gaming (the burners I would say).
- First of all, I don't see obvious mistakes about history. Unfortunately this is not so common in gaming books.
- I do like the way we "get the sense that you are immersed in a world that moves, and will soon undergo a great amount of change". And the only other game I felt this is the one I am working on now for more than two years and that this is the very reason I asked to join the team.
- I really enjoyed the way the major conflicts from this time period are being synthethised, such are the main campaigns to be played in it.
- I enjoyed burners too and I think this is a very good way to present information and questions to ask.
- But the major drawback for me is the part about the period is so small. It gaves some color and event though I understand it is not the purpose of the game (see 1) above) I feel frustrated because introduction to Heian era is both so good and so small. And it is because it is good that I feel frustrated.
- The reader should really understand this not a simulationist game regardings to the setting (french gamers are not so used to historical not simulationnist games)
- For my personnal tastes, when I buy a historical RPG, I like to have both a an indepth compilation and a perspective. BaF is very bad on the first point (of course, this is not its purpose), and excellent on the second.

Believe me, this is really not an "unfavorable" review. I except it to be clearer now. And this is definetly not a review from somebody which cannot stand setting-light games either. Princes Kingdom, Primetime adventures, My life with master, or Little fears to name a few

And by the way, I accept any BW, Rifts or Forgotten realms book anybody want to sent me ;)




EDIT : thank you sanj for the translation

[Drozdal]

hey brand!

Thanx for stopping by, clearing up things and writing that review!

There is no such thing as bad publicity ;)

[Paul B]

I totally get where Brand is coming from. It's precisely the same beef so many people have about BE: Not much "factual" data about the setting, and what there is, is buried in the LPs and traits and skills. If the reader isn't looking for tasty hooks and conflicts, it makes the book seem kind of insubstantial.

Some people want period details out of their medieval Japanese game, others want narrative truth. I'm really good at doing my own research so, personally, I really appreciated how Blossoms drills down to the core conflicts/issues/themes at the heart of both the genre and period.

p.

[brand]

That's exactly my feeling. I don't think the game is bad (for me it kind of fits its purpose). And even if I thought so, it would be dishonest as I couldn't benefit for the most part. Just I thought it would have been better if there were more.

[luke]

But the major drawback for me is the part about the period is so small. It gaves some color and event though I understand it is not the purpose of the game (see 1) above) I feel frustrated because introduction to Heian era is both so good and so small. And it is because it is good that I feel frustrated.

If this taste of the setting doesn't make you want to play the game, then our model of game writing has failed!

[Fuseboy]

If this taste of the setting doesn't make you want to play the game, then our model of game writing has failed!

For what it's worth, I think it's a good model. Detailed fluff in role-playing games is only really useful when it's appreciated by a majority of the players, otherwise you just wind up with a detailed but private impression of the world.

Settings like Over the Edge or Skyrealms of Jorune both really impress me, but difficult to play unless you're happy to either flip a lot or blissfully disgregard 'canon'. It sucks to have a world the players feel is unfamiliar. (I'd love to play a Burning Jorune one day, with wises substituting for the pre-written cyclopedia of flora and fauna!)

Having nearly no published fluff pushes the world-defining task into the character/world-burning session. I think this is brilliant, particularly for free-time challenged adults; you don't have to pass around a setting book months in advance. Mega-fluff appreciation is a solo activity. :-)

My only reservation is that I think this minimalist approach works best when the lifepaths are immediately recognizable or self-explanatory, so you can easily translate your concepts into the lifepaths, and suss out your options by skimming them. I guess there's a difficult line to tread between using jargon to be evocative (e.g. "Ninja" instead of "Assassin", "Fedaykin" instead of "Commando") and sending people looking for absent additional information to feel like they know what they're getting into. Foreign-language lifepath names (e.g. Kerrn and Blossoms) are problematic, I think.

[brand]

For what it's worth, I think it's a good model.

For what it is worth, I think the same.
As far as I am concerned, I read it with both a designer and medieval japan enthusiast (not sure how to write this word) point of view. Not as a GM per se. I found it really interesting and well made and do not consider it as a failure at all.