Thinking about Block

[Rindu]

There's one thing about Block that I don't quite get. It seems to me that, if I am wielding a knife, then I ought to have a lot of trouble Blocking an opponent wielding a Battle Axe. I think I would just get my hand chopped off if I tried something like that! The Block description doesn't go into this.

Is it assumed that when I block an axe with a knife, I am doing something different than matching blade to blade, or is there a need for a rule modification here?

[Kublai]

The Block action doesn't necessarily mean a blade-to-blade clash, as you correctly imagined. Blocking takes into consideration a wide variety of moves and parries a trained fighter would use. Take for instance a knife fighter knocking the axeman's elbow with his forearm. Use your imagination to figure out how exactly the fighter prevents the opponent's blow from landing.

[Rindu]

Thanks for all the replies. :)

[eruditus]

Yeah, the key here is a combination of imagination, flexability and a solid foundation of maturity, sometimes. remember that "its in the rules" is very rarely a viable justification for doing something in game. I wouldn't say that a new rule need be adopted for every minute permutation of combat but a GM certainly could say "you insist to block the bardiche head on with your dirk so I am going to have to say that your block is at
-1D and hits go to the arm."

If the player isn't going to be creative (as Kublai suggests) then expect to be dubbed "stumpy" by your adventuring fellows :D

[luke]

The Block action doesn't necessarily mean a blade-to-blade clash, as you correctly imagined. Blocking takes into consideration a wide variety of moves and parries a trained fighter would use. Take for instance a knife fighter knocking the axeman's elbow with his forearm. Use your imagination to figure out how exactly the fighter prevents the opponent's blow from landing.

Pete is the author of the Block rules, so I would go with his interpretation. Over years of testing and pushing this system, he showed me that nearly anything could be "blocked."

In fact, I was doing some research some months ago and discovered that 16th-17th century fencers knocked aside their opponents' weapons with their bare hands!

-Luke

[Yagathai]

I particularly enjoy the bootheel-parry.

[Viper]

It's insanely hard to parry a battle-axe, even with a sword- the damn things have a LOT of power behind them. Thing is, as Pete said, there's more to blocking than just meeting the incoming weapon head on. Most blocks, armed or unarmed, are more about redirecting the blow as opposed to stopping it dead. For example, in martial arts, somone throws a punch at your head, your hand comes up, impacting your opponent's wrist, knocking the blow just enough off target that it hits the air next to you, instead of your precious melon. A similar thing can happen with your knife wielder- as the big bad viking raises his axe to split you in two, you turn deftly and knock his arm as it comes down, causing a shower of sparks as the axe hits the cobblestone.

The flipside of the coin is that in terms of style, I picture a knifefighter as very nimble, and more likely to use avoid than block if he can help it, just constantly dancing out of the way of those big, unwieldy weapons, or using counterstrike to get in a number of quick cuts while avoiding getting hit himself. Also, you can always avoid in, and not have to even get outside of striking distance- it means an extra obstacle, but if your character's nimble enough, it shouldn't be too much of a worry.

[JKahrs]

One thing I learned while taking boxing classses (besides that I was too old and too slow) was that you didn't need to block much to get a good effect. Even a small difference in trajectory of a blow causes it to hit a less vulnerable, more heavily armored part of your body. If you tried to completly knock shots out of the way, you usually left yourself rather vulnerable to a combo. So, a knife block is much more a slight redirect than a full on clash of steel parry.

[worldeater]

Pete is the author of the Block rules, so I would go with his interpretation. Over years of testing and pushing this system, he showed me that nearly anything could be "blocked."

In fact, I was doing some research some months ago and discovered that 16th-17th century fencers knocked aside their opponents' weapons with their bare hands!

-Luke

I can agree with the statement that a block is always possible (at least on a human scale). However, I agree with Rindu's point that there should be something to reflect the difficulty of blocking a sword or axe with a small weapon like a knife. If could be a rule as simple as increasing the blocker's Ob by 1, meaning that the first blocking success doesn't count.

Just because stopping or nullifying a swordsman's attack bare-handed is possible doesn't mean it's as easy as stopping that same attack with a sword of one's own.

Alan

[Wuxing]

Just because stopping or nullifying a swordsman's attack bare-handed is possible doesn't mean it's as easy as stopping that same attack with a sword of one's own.

You have to loosen up what you think of when you think block. Honestly I think most people say block and actually what we mean is deflect. It's one of those things you learn as you practice/train. Well you learn or end up getting hurt a lot. :D

I'm not trying to be snarky here, but get in a few fights. I can tell you from experiences as a "fighter" as a kid and through a variety of martial arts everything mentioned about about just deflecting a blow a small amount is very accurate.

If that fails, just shrug and think it's fantasy. We can accept fireballs and lightning bolts but have a problem with blocking?!?! :P

[Kublai]

If could be a rule as simple as increasing the blocker's Ob by 1, meaning that the first blocking success doesn't count.

An additional Obstacle may mean the difference between life and death. BW is already pretty unforgiving. I wouldn't dare impose such weapon-size penalties upon my players.

[foxandwarlock]

BW is pretty general about weapons, it seems like.

In terms of damage, speed and everything else a sword is a sword is a sword. So if you're going to impose Ob penalties for a knife vs. axe then you have to start looking at all weapon sizes - how big is the axe? What about a short sword versus an axe? What about a short sword versus a Bastard Sword, that probably has close to the same kind of ratio as a knife to axe. Otherwise, your knife player (that's me) is going to start complaining things aren't fair.

TROS has weapon length rules and they made a huge difference but they also have a very, very crunchy combat system to support/go along with the weapon sizes. BW seems to "loose" to implement those kind of rules.