How many factors are you typically using?

[buzz]

I've run "Trouble n Grasslake" twice so far. I've noticed (and had it commented to me) that, badass Nature 8 turtle aside, obstacles tended to be pretty high for most tests, at least compared to the skills the sample PCs had. E.g., Sloan's player wanted to make some replacement window-panes, but even a generous reading of the factors for Glazier had the task at Ob 3. With her Glazier 2, even with help, that's pretty tough.

So, am I just factoring in too many factors? It seems that even basic tasks will net Ob 3, which is tough for even a skilled (Skill 3-4) PC. Or, is that the intent?

[wanderer]

I tend to use a lot of Ob 4s and even Ob 5s, especially for things that involve the whole patrol.

[Aramis]

My obs have ranged from 2 to 7 in the last two sessions, lots of ob 3 & ob 4.

Loads of opposed rolls, with opposition pools of 6-12d. (Which means, roughly, equivalent to Obs 3-6...)

[stormsweeper]

It's the intent. She succeeds, no sweat off anyone's nose. She fails, you either twist or you give a condition. In many RPGs, failures are "dead ends" but in MG it's almost the opposite.

[buzz]

It's the intent. She succeeds, no sweat off anyone's nose. She fails, you either twist or you give a condition. In many RPGs, failures are "dead ends" but in MG it's almost the opposite.

Very true. But failure+twist still means that the player does not get their intent, right?

[Rafe]

Very true. But failure+twist still means that the player does not get their intent, right?

Once they pass the twist or receive a condition, they achieve whatever it was that caused the condition/twist. So if the intent is to cross a stream and they fail and you apply a condition (Tired for having a hard time getting across, for example), they're across.

[Aramis]

If you twist, once the twist is resolved or back-burnered, they accomplish their intent as well.

At least, by the letter of the rules.

[Stormtower]

.... It seems that even basic tasks will net Ob 3, which is tough for even a skilled (Skill 3-4) PC. Or, is that the intent?

I think the other thread will eventually lead to this answer ...

Obstacles look "tough" for two reasons:

1. It allows other mice to help. "What's gonna work? Teamwork!"
2. Failure at the check doesn't mean you don't get what you want ... you might have to pay a little bit more to get to that success.

You can also look at it this way ... the only way to advance a skill is with BOTH successes and failures.

[Aramis]

Most PC's will have at least one skill at 4, and often a trait, a wise, and a tool, for 7d, and 50%. Add one helper and you have 8d, and is about 66% likely to make 4s and pass an Ob3. Adding a die (9d) from a second helper pushes it to about 76%.
Ob 3 isn't tough for a normal group of 4 mice with one having skill 4 and the rest having some relevant help skill. With 3 mice, it's still likely, without artha.

7d outcomes:1x0 7x1, 21x2 35x3, 35x4, 21x5, 7x6, 1x7 /128
Ob 1: 99.2%
Ob 2: 35+35+21+7+1=99/128=77.4%
Ob 3: 35+21+7+1=64/128=50%
Ob 4: 21+7+1=29/128 = 22.7%
Ob 5: 7+1=8/128 = 6.3%
Ob 6: 1 = 1/128 = 0.8%

attaining 9d isn't that hard, either. For a lone mouse, it's skill 6 (peak), Wise, Tool, and Trait. In a group of four, that's skill 3, 3 helpers, a wise, a tool, and a trait.

Ob 3 is only hard when alone and low skilled.

[buzz]

Aramis, I think you're being pretty generous. In the Grasslake scenario, the PCs have a lot of skills at 2, and all of their Traits are level 1, so are one-use barring recharge, and wises that aren't always relevant. What you're describing is a best-case scenario. Against the turtle, they are looking at a *minimum* of 8 dice in opposition.

Which may very well be intentional, of course.